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October 20, 2008

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~Michelle~

Oh Liz. Don't you have a best friend? One who knows you? One who has known you thru the difficult trials and joys of life? Because I do. The saddest thing to me is thinking some guy one meets on eHarmony and dates for 6 months could ever ever EVER compare with that.

Men are great. Unless one is bi or gay, men are how one gets physical intimacy, and fun and laughter and also personal growth thru intimacy and issues. Which is great. But Men come and go. Girlfriends are forever. And when you have some fantastic news... THAT is who ya need to call.

I know you are a feminist...so why do you not have Girlfriends? And why do you put some random romantic relationship (by which I mean a relationship which is not a long term deep commitment like marriage or similar) ahead of female friendships?

Shouldn't a feminist value and support female friendships?

Kim

Though I'm not saying I never get lonely -- especially right now when my emotions are ALLL OVER the place -- I grew up being very much with myself. Sometimes I was bored, but between books, tv, and being largely unpopular at school, I was very much a loner. Even when I moved out here, it was just me and my brother for quite a few years before I thought about dating. I had myself, a few friends from work who I never actually WENT anywhere with and the dog. Between the dog and my diaries, I was a very contented person. I still crave that alone time. It is when I am most creative, when I can concentrate on just my thoughts, my ideas, my words, nothing else.

Even in work, I like the job where I don't have to deal with people. It's mostly me and the file I'm working on, some other editors, but no clients who can get pissed at me. I stay safely with my friends/acquaintences. Yeah, maybe THAT sounds sad, but I'm okay with it.

Maybe I live with lonely too... or at least I used to. I think lonely is my friend. And I was used to it for a long time. Like a bad boyfriend you know is bad for you, but you like anyway. :)

Liz

Hi ~M~ - Personally, I find the refrain "men come and go, but friends are forever" very sad. I hope and believe I will find a man to spend the rest of my life with. That man will be family. My relationships in my 20s were all like that, but they didn't work out.

That said, I do have a handful of the type of friends you're talking about, and they all live on the East coast in a different time zone. They have kids and houses and other lives now. One of them I did make in Los Angeles, but she moved. That's what people do here; they move away. I'm as open to finding another friend like that out here as I am a partner, but it's a similar situation. Meantime, I did say that I value my friendships very much, but it's difficult when friends are far away.

However, I do remember a time when I had friends like that to call that I saw regularly and were part of my life like that. I'm working on that here; it's just challenging.

Kim - You know, it's interesting, I've always been a fairly solitary person, too. Only child, not a lot of family. I totally get what you're saying here. I definitely need my space in a relationship, too. You know, I bet as your personal life gets wonderfully full, your job remains that solace space to be more solitary.

Dating Trooper

Beautifully said, Liz. I used to think that Lonely would go away when I had that partner in my life. True, it comes around far less often, but it still drops by from time to time. Sometimes it almost feels sadder to be Lonely when your partner is right there in bed next to you. And I think that is just because when it comes down to it - no matter how many friends or lovers or children or pets we have - we are all alone at our core. I don't mean to sound depressing, because it's actually kind of a beautiful thought in a way. That we are individual souls trying to connect with others, often succeeding, but never merging into one and losing our individuality.

When I felt Lonely the most as a single person was traveling on business, particularly at night in my hotel. No one to call and say "I'm home," let alone someone to meet me when I arrived home at the airport and made the long walk to my car.

That being said, you are absolutely right that the best thing you can do is embrace the feeling, walk up to it and say, "Hi Lonely. Come in and sit down for awhile. But then leave because I've got a life to live."

~Michelle~

I see what you are saying Liz. It's hard to move away from the people you have loved and try and make a life with all new people. The friendship bond is just not as strong as the one you have with people you knew when you were young, mostly bc there isn't years and years of history to bind you together.

That's on a practical sense. But in another sense -- while I agree a marital or similarly deep long term commitment takes precendence usually over a female friendship, I am totally irritated by the attitude I see in some women where they only engage in female friendships when there isn't a man around. Especially when they are dating someone for a few months and put that relationship ahead of a deep friendship they've had with a female friend for years and years. I don't have a problem with women putting a deeply loving and committed relationship with a man in their number one spot, but I sure do have a problem with women who act like female friendships are unimportant in comparison to HAVING A MAN. You know?

People can do what they like -- I am just saying, I am not friends with those women.

Liz

Dating Trooper - I do remember that feeling of lonely when you're with someone, and it was tough. It was like that a lot with my ex-fiance. It's true though that no one is ever going to fully, completely get absolutely everything about you. I guess that makes it interesting. :)

~M~ - I hear you; I do. There can be a problem when someone completely dumps all her friends for a guy. But sometimes there's a problem when someone starts dating after being single a long time, and her friends overreact to the inevitable change in her schedule and life. So often these days I find that people don't respect love. Certainly, I've seen friendships end because of both situations. Balance, as always, is the key. I try to always be respectful of the romantic love in my friend's lives because it is truly so important.

I'm a romantic; there's no hiding that. :)

laurie

I keep thinking about this post...I told you on BlogHer that it resonated so much for me, but it really really does...I'm trying to use this time to work on some stuff that I know makes me a better friend to anyone and everyone, but sometimes it's hard. No matter how many girlfriends you have (and other male friends, too) there is something about having a partner - a good one, of course - that is good and essential to life.

I was never one to shut my friends out when I had a relationship, even a new one. The best friends I've got don't do that and that's why they're my best friends, but there's no denying that their partners and kids still come first. I find myself having to make the effort, make the plans, work around other peoples' situations. And whereas I don't mind that for the most part, it can get old.

Anyway, this is something I haven't tried to put into words and I'm glad you did.

Liz

Hi Laurie,

I so hear you. A romantic and life partner is just different, and no matter how much people go on about friendship, friends of course put their partners and children first. There's always going to be those moments, even with the closest friends.

But we just have to keep being us and living and loving our lives and keeping the faith. Because that's where my happiness comes from, being true to myself and what's good for me.

I know we're on the right path! < big hugs >

Man

I have never felt more lonely than I do as a married man. In a way, I find it worse than feeling lonely as as single person.

Liz

Man - I'm so sorry that you feel that way. I also feel like anything I say is sure to be something you've heard before. So I guess all I can say is, I hope it gets better. I hope you and your wife can find some mutual interest to share or something, anything to help you feel less lonely in your marriage. I can definitely see where it would be worse than single and lonely. Hang in there.

Thomai

This is profoundly moving. Lovely.

Liz

Thank you, Thomai. These are my favorite blog posts, where I moved into a feeling and write from that place. If that makes any sense at all. That's how I feel about when I write these sorts of things.

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